07-28-2006, 09:37 PM
07-28-2006, 11:10 PM
londonsquare @ Sat Jul 29, 2006 12:37 am Wrote:
...... on Lebanese civilians I wonder if this will raise the level of outrage :sad:
They have been killing civilians on purpose, this is not news to me! What about the UN guys??? They called Israel more than 10 times and tried to stop the shelling around them? Olmert should go to the Hague and be tried as a war criminal.
07-29-2006, 12:11 AM
Posh 2
Dont condone the fighting in any way shape of form .
,but the isreali army is out to anialate hezbollah as they( hezballah ) are certainly out to do the same to isreal .
rockets are landing all over israel fired from vilages in lebanon and the hezbellah terrorists wear civilian clothes and live and socialise amounst the inhabitants .
there is no way to seperate military from civilian ( like in a typical war ) and the local poeple have been warned to leave town before the shelling starts . no excuse but the alternative is not a viable one either .
The hezlallah rockets are being aim in civilan populated areas on perpose as well .
[QUOTE ]FROM TODAYS NEWS
Hundreds of Katyushas have hit northern Israel in the current fighting, including 96 on Friday, *one of which hit a hospital.* The Afula strike came two days after Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah vowed his guerrillas would fire rockets beyond Haifa, Israel's third-largest city, which has been hit repeatedly in the conflict.
END [QUOTE]
Nobody has clean hands
Just somethings to thing about before you make judgement thats all .
I like to be objective
killing civilians in a war even years after will still be hotly debated on moral grounds
the condemation of president truman ( dem ) 1945-1953 for authorizing the dropping of two atomic bombs on japan and killing millions to end WW11 is still thought of as morally wrong and unjustified ( expecially the second one ) by some today .
Dont condone the fighting in any way shape of form .
,but the isreali army is out to anialate hezbollah as they( hezballah ) are certainly out to do the same to isreal .
rockets are landing all over israel fired from vilages in lebanon and the hezbellah terrorists wear civilian clothes and live and socialise amounst the inhabitants .
there is no way to seperate military from civilian ( like in a typical war ) and the local poeple have been warned to leave town before the shelling starts . no excuse but the alternative is not a viable one either .
The hezlallah rockets are being aim in civilan populated areas on perpose as well .
[QUOTE ]FROM TODAYS NEWS
Hundreds of Katyushas have hit northern Israel in the current fighting, including 96 on Friday, *one of which hit a hospital.* The Afula strike came two days after Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah vowed his guerrillas would fire rockets beyond Haifa, Israel's third-largest city, which has been hit repeatedly in the conflict.
END [QUOTE]
Nobody has clean hands
Just somethings to thing about before you make judgement thats all .
I like to be objective
killing civilians in a war even years after will still be hotly debated on moral grounds
the condemation of president truman ( dem ) 1945-1953 for authorizing the dropping of two atomic bombs on japan and killing millions to end WW11 is still thought of as morally wrong and unjustified ( expecially the second one ) by some today .
07-29-2006, 12:38 AM
Here is one opinion of hezbellah . looks pretty favourable . but violence in my opinion is not condoned for any reason .
Two Faces of Hezbollah
The west calls them terrorists, but in Lebanon they are poised to become major political players.
By Kevin Sites, Thu Dec 29, 637 PM ET
Email Story IM Story
BEIRUT, Lebanon - Lebanon's militant political group Hezbollah (Party of God) has become a global brand name. But for Hezbollah -- and those who must deal with the group -- the overarching question is, "What's the brand?"
The United States, the United Kingdom, Australia, Canada, and the parliament of the
European Union all designate Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, and not without some evidence.
Litany of Terror Attacks
The U.S. government blames Hezbollah for a litany of acts that nearly defined Middle East terrorism in the mid-'80s, including the Beirut truck bombings in October 1983 that killed 241 U.S. Marines; the April 1983 U.S. Embassy bombing in Beirut which killed 63 people and a second bombing of the U.S. Embassy that killed 22 people in September 1984; and the 1985 hijacking of Rome-to-Athens TWA Flight 847 in which a
U.S. Navy diver was killed (the man convicted for the murder was just released by German authorities after serving 19 years in prison).
Hezbollah denies involvement in any of these attacks.
The U.S. also claims the group carried out a series of kidnappings of Westerners from 1982-92, including the torture and killings of
CIA station chief William Buckley and U.S. Army Colonel William Higgins; and the abductions of American journalist Terry Anderson and the Archbishop of Canterbury's special envoy, Terry Waite.
Complex Organization
Most experts and observers agree that Hezbollah is a complex organization. In a 2003 report, the Brussels-based International Crisis Group wrote
"Fully penetrating Hezbollah's decision-making process is almost impossible. The movement enjoys a highly effective regime of internal discipline and concealment."
In addition to its militia, Hezbollah has a full-scale multimedia operation including a media relations department (ironically, when I arrived there to conduct interviews, I was not allowed to videotape and only managed to take this photo).
Still, Hezbollah's media wing is savvy. It publishes a monthly magazine called Qubth Ut Alla, (The Fist of God) and runs television network Al-Manar (The Lighthouse) and radio station al-Nour (The Light).
Hezbollah also maintains an aggressive program of charitable work, including building schools and hospitals for the Shia community in Lebanon.
And though it defines itself through opposition to
Israel and the U.S., it has also condemned the 9/11 attacks and spoken out against some of the beheadings by insurgents in
Iraq.
Hezbollah, made up of Shia Muslims, also says it has no connection to Osama Bin Laden's Al Qaeda (dominated by Wahabist Sunnis who consider Shias heretics).
"This organization should be considered the most patriotic in Lebanon."— Hezbollah Director of Foreign Media Hussein Naboulsi
In an interview at their businesslike media relations office in west Beirut, Director of Foreign Media Hussein Naboulsi tries to clarify for me some of the enigma that is Hezbollah.
"Hezbollah is Hezbollah," he says, "there's no change in its definition. It's a political, religious party created as a reaction to Israel's invasion [of Lebanon] in 1982. Politically it's represented in both cabinet and parliament, and considered by all to be a legitimate party. But if you're against Israel, the U.S. administration labels you as they want."
Israel is uncompromising on its view of Hezbollah. Reached for comment on Hezbollah's emergence as a political force in Lebanon, Jeremy Issacharoff, deputy chief of the Israeli embassy to the U.S., said, "Israel's position regarding the blatant terroristic nature of Hezbollah is well known and needs no further elaboration."
Liberators?
And despite the terrorist allegations, many in Lebanon, especially among the majority Shia community (an estimated 40% of the population) consider Hezbollah a resistance movement. Some even regard Hezbollah as liberators that forced Israel to retreat from southern Lebanon in 2000.
"This organization should be considered the most patriotic in Lebanon," says Naboulsi. "We fought the Israelis and forced them to leave. Hezbollah sacrificed 1,800 martyrs and thousands of wounded soldiers for the sake of this country --for the sake of dignity and honor of this country."
Because of that perception, Hezbollah is the only faction in the country allowed to keep weapons, ostensibly as a buffer against Israeli incursions. Naboulsi says the militia has earned the right to be armed.
"Fighting the Israelis is not a picnic; it's blood spilled. It's not a reward in a festival," he says, his voice rising with emphasis. "No one can take that mission unless he has faith -- extreme faith and loyalty to this country."
Political Entity
Now Hezbollah is deep into several phases of another mission that of becoming a credible and viable political entity in the fractious sphere of Lebanese politics.
The first time it got involved in the political process was in 1992, winning 12 seats in the 128-seat parliament. But in an alliance with the Shia Amal party, it nearly doubled those numbers in the 2005 general election, taking 23 seats.
Hezbollah was also given cabinet posts when it cast its lot with the current alliance of parties forming the Lebanese government.
"There's a great ambition," says Naboulsi, "We want to see real reform in Lebanon. But that reform should begin with a just electoral law -- not based on sectarian factors, but proportional representation. In proportional representation, I win and you win. Everybody has a seat in the parliament. It's good for all Lebanese."
But not all Lebanese agree. The current Lebanese democracy is based on a decades-old practice of what's called "consensus politics," a complicated formula in which Lebanon's different ethnic and religious factions are apportioned specific government slots, regardless of their makeup in the total population. Christian groups particularly are concerned that changes in the electoral law could lead to dominance by a Shia or Muslim alliance.
Theocracy
Hezbollah has said in the past that it would like to see Lebanon become a theocratic state in the model of one of its primary funders and supporters
Iran. But it has quietly backed off a bit from those statements recently, perhaps in the hopes of appearing more conciliatory.
And it may need to be, to offset what may end up being a costly political position for these days that of providing full support to its other primary financial supporter,
Syria.
"Fully penetrating Hezbollah's decision-making process is almost impossible. The movement enjoys a highly effective regime of internal discipline and concealment."— The International Crisis Group
Hezbollah actively opposed what was dubbed "Cedar Revolution," the democratic outcry following the assassination of former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafik Hariri. Along with international pressure, the events led to the withdrawal of Syrian troops after nearly 30 years in Lebanon.
"The Syrians played a key role in the stability of Lebanon, putting an end to the civil war," says Naboulsi. "And Syria really supported the resistance which ended up forcing the Israeli enemy out of Lebanon."
But being that outspoken has a price. Some Christian parties want to see Hezbollah disarmed (something already called for by
United Nations resolution 1559) and may have used that threat, some say, to push Hezbollah and the Amal party to support an expanded UN investigation into the Hariri killing -- something which they both initially opposed.
Key Player
The government is still in a deadlock, near collapse. But Hezbollah is rumored to be a key player in an unlikely alliance with a longtime foe former Lebanese general Michel Aoun, a staunch anti-Syrian who recently returned from 15 years of exile in France, following the Syrian troop withdrawal.
Naboulsi says Hezbollah reached out to Aoun first.
"Even when Michel Aoun was in Paris and no one dared to speak to him," he says. "We were the first to begin the open dialogue. You can't make other sects your enemy."
If Aoun's supporters and Hezbollah make a deal to get the government running again, it could provide Hezbollah with more credibility. It would also seem to demonstrate a commitment beyond its own interests and that of Syria's, to a unified Lebanon.
"Hezbollah is an essential part of Lebanon which no one can ignore," says Naboulsi. "It's the biggest party of the biggest sector of the population and because of consensus democracy, no one can form a government without our contribution."
And for its own political base, Hezbollah's anti-Israeli, anti-American rhetoric is part of the appeal. Hezbollah has called for the destruction of Israel and even offered to open up a second front against the Israelis during the Palestinian intifada.
As for the U.S. designating Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, Naboulsi is matter-of-fact any future dialogue is doubtful.
"The American government has labeled us as terrorists," he says. "They say they don't negotiate with terrorists -- and neither do we."
Two Faces of Hezbollah
The west calls them terrorists, but in Lebanon they are poised to become major political players.
By Kevin Sites, Thu Dec 29, 637 PM ET
Email Story IM Story
BEIRUT, Lebanon - Lebanon's militant political group Hezbollah (Party of God) has become a global brand name. But for Hezbollah -- and those who must deal with the group -- the overarching question is, "What's the brand?"
The United States, the United Kingdom, Australia, Canada, and the parliament of the
European Union all designate Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, and not without some evidence.
Litany of Terror Attacks
The U.S. government blames Hezbollah for a litany of acts that nearly defined Middle East terrorism in the mid-'80s, including the Beirut truck bombings in October 1983 that killed 241 U.S. Marines; the April 1983 U.S. Embassy bombing in Beirut which killed 63 people and a second bombing of the U.S. Embassy that killed 22 people in September 1984; and the 1985 hijacking of Rome-to-Athens TWA Flight 847 in which a
U.S. Navy diver was killed (the man convicted for the murder was just released by German authorities after serving 19 years in prison).
Hezbollah denies involvement in any of these attacks.
The U.S. also claims the group carried out a series of kidnappings of Westerners from 1982-92, including the torture and killings of
CIA station chief William Buckley and U.S. Army Colonel William Higgins; and the abductions of American journalist Terry Anderson and the Archbishop of Canterbury's special envoy, Terry Waite.
Complex Organization
Most experts and observers agree that Hezbollah is a complex organization. In a 2003 report, the Brussels-based International Crisis Group wrote
"Fully penetrating Hezbollah's decision-making process is almost impossible. The movement enjoys a highly effective regime of internal discipline and concealment."
In addition to its militia, Hezbollah has a full-scale multimedia operation including a media relations department (ironically, when I arrived there to conduct interviews, I was not allowed to videotape and only managed to take this photo).
Still, Hezbollah's media wing is savvy. It publishes a monthly magazine called Qubth Ut Alla, (The Fist of God) and runs television network Al-Manar (The Lighthouse) and radio station al-Nour (The Light).
Hezbollah also maintains an aggressive program of charitable work, including building schools and hospitals for the Shia community in Lebanon.
And though it defines itself through opposition to
Israel and the U.S., it has also condemned the 9/11 attacks and spoken out against some of the beheadings by insurgents in
Iraq.
Hezbollah, made up of Shia Muslims, also says it has no connection to Osama Bin Laden's Al Qaeda (dominated by Wahabist Sunnis who consider Shias heretics).
"This organization should be considered the most patriotic in Lebanon."— Hezbollah Director of Foreign Media Hussein Naboulsi
In an interview at their businesslike media relations office in west Beirut, Director of Foreign Media Hussein Naboulsi tries to clarify for me some of the enigma that is Hezbollah.
"Hezbollah is Hezbollah," he says, "there's no change in its definition. It's a political, religious party created as a reaction to Israel's invasion [of Lebanon] in 1982. Politically it's represented in both cabinet and parliament, and considered by all to be a legitimate party. But if you're against Israel, the U.S. administration labels you as they want."
Israel is uncompromising on its view of Hezbollah. Reached for comment on Hezbollah's emergence as a political force in Lebanon, Jeremy Issacharoff, deputy chief of the Israeli embassy to the U.S., said, "Israel's position regarding the blatant terroristic nature of Hezbollah is well known and needs no further elaboration."
Liberators?
And despite the terrorist allegations, many in Lebanon, especially among the majority Shia community (an estimated 40% of the population) consider Hezbollah a resistance movement. Some even regard Hezbollah as liberators that forced Israel to retreat from southern Lebanon in 2000.
"This organization should be considered the most patriotic in Lebanon," says Naboulsi. "We fought the Israelis and forced them to leave. Hezbollah sacrificed 1,800 martyrs and thousands of wounded soldiers for the sake of this country --for the sake of dignity and honor of this country."
Because of that perception, Hezbollah is the only faction in the country allowed to keep weapons, ostensibly as a buffer against Israeli incursions. Naboulsi says the militia has earned the right to be armed.
"Fighting the Israelis is not a picnic; it's blood spilled. It's not a reward in a festival," he says, his voice rising with emphasis. "No one can take that mission unless he has faith -- extreme faith and loyalty to this country."
Political Entity
Now Hezbollah is deep into several phases of another mission that of becoming a credible and viable political entity in the fractious sphere of Lebanese politics.
The first time it got involved in the political process was in 1992, winning 12 seats in the 128-seat parliament. But in an alliance with the Shia Amal party, it nearly doubled those numbers in the 2005 general election, taking 23 seats.
Hezbollah was also given cabinet posts when it cast its lot with the current alliance of parties forming the Lebanese government.
"There's a great ambition," says Naboulsi, "We want to see real reform in Lebanon. But that reform should begin with a just electoral law -- not based on sectarian factors, but proportional representation. In proportional representation, I win and you win. Everybody has a seat in the parliament. It's good for all Lebanese."
But not all Lebanese agree. The current Lebanese democracy is based on a decades-old practice of what's called "consensus politics," a complicated formula in which Lebanon's different ethnic and religious factions are apportioned specific government slots, regardless of their makeup in the total population. Christian groups particularly are concerned that changes in the electoral law could lead to dominance by a Shia or Muslim alliance.
Theocracy
Hezbollah has said in the past that it would like to see Lebanon become a theocratic state in the model of one of its primary funders and supporters
Iran. But it has quietly backed off a bit from those statements recently, perhaps in the hopes of appearing more conciliatory.
And it may need to be, to offset what may end up being a costly political position for these days that of providing full support to its other primary financial supporter,
Syria.
"Fully penetrating Hezbollah's decision-making process is almost impossible. The movement enjoys a highly effective regime of internal discipline and concealment."— The International Crisis Group
Hezbollah actively opposed what was dubbed "Cedar Revolution," the democratic outcry following the assassination of former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafik Hariri. Along with international pressure, the events led to the withdrawal of Syrian troops after nearly 30 years in Lebanon.
"The Syrians played a key role in the stability of Lebanon, putting an end to the civil war," says Naboulsi. "And Syria really supported the resistance which ended up forcing the Israeli enemy out of Lebanon."
But being that outspoken has a price. Some Christian parties want to see Hezbollah disarmed (something already called for by
United Nations resolution 1559) and may have used that threat, some say, to push Hezbollah and the Amal party to support an expanded UN investigation into the Hariri killing -- something which they both initially opposed.
Key Player
The government is still in a deadlock, near collapse. But Hezbollah is rumored to be a key player in an unlikely alliance with a longtime foe former Lebanese general Michel Aoun, a staunch anti-Syrian who recently returned from 15 years of exile in France, following the Syrian troop withdrawal.
Naboulsi says Hezbollah reached out to Aoun first.
"Even when Michel Aoun was in Paris and no one dared to speak to him," he says. "We were the first to begin the open dialogue. You can't make other sects your enemy."
If Aoun's supporters and Hezbollah make a deal to get the government running again, it could provide Hezbollah with more credibility. It would also seem to demonstrate a commitment beyond its own interests and that of Syria's, to a unified Lebanon.
"Hezbollah is an essential part of Lebanon which no one can ignore," says Naboulsi. "It's the biggest party of the biggest sector of the population and because of consensus democracy, no one can form a government without our contribution."
And for its own political base, Hezbollah's anti-Israeli, anti-American rhetoric is part of the appeal. Hezbollah has called for the destruction of Israel and even offered to open up a second front against the Israelis during the Palestinian intifada.
As for the U.S. designating Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, Naboulsi is matter-of-fact any future dialogue is doubtful.
"The American government has labeled us as terrorists," he says. "They say they don't negotiate with terrorists -- and neither do we."
07-29-2006, 07:58 AM
JohnA @ Sat 29 Jul, 2006 Wrote:
Here is one opinion of hezbellah . looks pretty favourable . but violence in my opinion is not condoned for any reason .
Same could have been said of the beginings of the Likud party in Israel.
They had their start in the Irgun and Haganah organizations that would have been labled terrorists today.
One of the leaders Menachem Begin, who later became PM,organized many attacks for the Irgun including the killing of a UN official.
Todays terrorists may be tomorrows leaders.
07-29-2006, 09:29 AM
Keith, don't forget the Stern Gang, it was an even more vicious offshoot of Irgun.
Irgun blew up the King David Hotel, Menachem Begin was the planner. Shamir was a member of Irgun and then moved to the Stern gang.
Incidentally, sweet little Dr. Ruth was a fiighter for Haganah, some say she was a sniper.
Irgun blew up the King David Hotel, Menachem Begin was the planner. Shamir was a member of Irgun and then moved to the Stern gang.
Incidentally, sweet little Dr. Ruth was a fiighter for Haganah, some say she was a sniper.
07-29-2006, 09:48 AM
An interesting article in todays Globe & Mail gives a historic perspective on the events that led to the formation of Israel. This is part of the article.
The committee had two basic choices: It could partition Palestine into two more or less uni-ethnic countries. Or it could leave it intact, creating a federal country with Jewish and Arab provinces, equal numbers of Jews and Arabs in the parliament, a neutral capital, a constitutionally secular state, and guaranteed full rights for both groups. That was the first idea to be proposed, by India and Yugoslavia and Iran.
The writer puts the blame on one Canadian for the decision to go with the two state.
Click blame Canadian
The committee had two basic choices: It could partition Palestine into two more or less uni-ethnic countries. Or it could leave it intact, creating a federal country with Jewish and Arab provinces, equal numbers of Jews and Arabs in the parliament, a neutral capital, a constitutionally secular state, and guaranteed full rights for both groups. That was the first idea to be proposed, by India and Yugoslavia and Iran.
The writer puts the blame on one Canadian for the decision to go with the two state.
Click blame Canadian
07-29-2006, 10:04 AM
Posh2 I did hear that one of the UN Guys that was killed. Emailed his commanding Officers in Canada telling him that Hezbollah had been moving closer to the UN compound to gain a tactical advantage.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
07-29-2006, 01:32 PM
This is the basic problem with democracy. We ask them to elect people toi rule them, they do, and we don't like their decisions. Not that Hezbollah was elected, but the only people disturbed were the Israelis. I think it's just the old, "let's have a war, it'll provide employment" mentality of my great grand dad.
Sooner or later they'll have to sit down and talk, just like the Brits and the IRA.
As to sending them to the war crimes court, America and Israel don't go along with this treaty, I wonder why not?
Sooner or later they'll have to sit down and talk, just like the Brits and the IRA.
As to sending them to the war crimes court, America and Israel don't go along with this treaty, I wonder why not?
07-29-2006, 04:31 PM
I find the Globe & Mail an excellent paper for thought provoking articles, especially the Saturday edition.
There is one section that reviews books and on the last page there is an article written by Nader Hashemi "What will rise out of Beirut's ashes"
It points out that through successive wars both defensive and pre-empted Israel has actually created the monsters that the US label terrorists. PLO, Hezbollah and Hamas were one of many that were born through Israeli attempts at defending it's borders.
Almost every 6 years since 1948 Israel has been engage in some war against it's neighbours.
I get the impression that eventually some Arab neighbour or "Terrorist" group will deal Israel a blow that will end up involving us all.
It's amazing that such a small number of people can create so much havoc with the lives of almost everyone on the planet.
Click Beirut
There is one section that reviews books and on the last page there is an article written by Nader Hashemi "What will rise out of Beirut's ashes"
It points out that through successive wars both defensive and pre-empted Israel has actually created the monsters that the US label terrorists. PLO, Hezbollah and Hamas were one of many that were born through Israeli attempts at defending it's borders.
Almost every 6 years since 1948 Israel has been engage in some war against it's neighbours.
I get the impression that eventually some Arab neighbour or "Terrorist" group will deal Israel a blow that will end up involving us all.
It's amazing that such a small number of people can create so much havoc with the lives of almost everyone on the planet.
Click Beirut
07-29-2006, 07:49 PM
annie @ Sat 29 Jul, 2006 Wrote:
This is the basic problem with democracy. We ask them to elect people toi rule them, they do, and we don't like their decisions. Not that Hezbollah was elected, but the only people disturbed were the Israelis. I think it's just the old, "let's have a war, it'll provide employment" mentality of my great grand dad.
Sooner or later they'll have to sit down and talk, just like the Brits and the IRA.
As to sending them to the war crimes court, America and Israel don't go along with this treaty, I wonder why not?
Sooner or later they'll have to sit down and talk, just like the Brits and the IRA.
As to sending them to the war crimes court, America and Israel don't go along with this treaty, I wonder why not?
Right on target with that Quote Monster I was just thinking the same thing today re: GWB and Iraq.
07-29-2006, 08:58 PM
It appears that it may be bringing on a rebellion in the cabinet:
Telegraph
It appears that despite Bush's apology, more planes, with bombs, were being refueled at Prestwick.
Telegraph
It appears that despite Bush's apology, more planes, with bombs, were being refueled at Prestwick.
07-29-2006, 09:52 PM
Goose3 @ Sat Jul 29, 2006 1:04 pm Wrote:
Posh2 I did hear that one of the UN Guys that was killed. Emailed his commanding Officers in Canada telling him that Hezbollah had been moving closer to the UN compound to gain a tactical advantage.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
The point is, these guys were there to try to help and paid a hefty price for doing so. They should not have killed them. When I see photos of little children with their hands missing or killed, I get very angry. Israel and Lebanon need to realise that the poor innocent people are getting killed, this should be enough to set aside any religious and political problems. How can someone watch the suffering of another human being and not feel compassion? It is shameful that the U.K. is going alongside with the U.S. on this one. Hate only breeds hate and someone needs to be the "ice-breaker".
07-31-2006, 12:31 PM
Goose3 @ Sat Jul 29, 2006 10:04 Wrote:
Posh2 I did hear that one of the UN Guys that was killed. Emailed his commanding Officers in Canada telling him that Hezbollah had been moving closer to the UN compound to gain a tactical advantage.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
No ones hands are clean in something like this.
Hizbollah is no doubt guilty of war crimes, in this case using no combatants for cover. However this does not justify Israel's actions or provide a defence to the war crimes they have commited.
It is no coincidence that the Isrealis would very much like the UN monitors out of the area so as to provide them with a free hand to do as they please.
07-31-2006, 07:12 PM
The UN should not be there unless they are prepared to use force against either side if they do not comply. It like having a cop standing there and watching you be robbed and doing nothing. Sooner or later people will say they are a waste of space and at the moment thats all the UN has become.
Thats why they tend to ask for NATO lead forces that a prepared to kick ass one side or other
Thats why they tend to ask for NATO lead forces that a prepared to kick ass one side or other
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