British Expatriate Network

Looks like Blunkett has gone ahead and in 4 years everyone in Britain will have to carry an ID card. Which you'll have to pay for too.

http//www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/28/nid28.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/10/28/ixhome.html

"Compulsory identity cards that can be used as a travel document in Europe are to be introduced within four years under a revised scheme published yesterday by David Blunkett, the Home Secretary.

It will be backed by a national register containing personal information about cardholders. This online database will hold an "audit log" detailing every occasion on which an individual's record has been checked."

Think its a pretty good idea. But it should be combined with the driving license sort of like it is here. They should also require ID at NHS facilities. I don't know if it should be compulsory rather that making it extremely difficult NOT to have one (re booze, fags, bank accounts, checks)....

Still think they should bar code peoples foreheads though. D

Ade, you are a neanderthal. barcodes are so yesterday
Microchipping under the skin is this week's big brother fashion statement.

So it seems that it wont be compulsary to carry it with you at all times.
I don't understand how they expect people, especially those apposed to it, to be forced into paying for something like this.

Also seem to be a lot of unanswered questions

Is it a one time card that you have for life?

At what age are you required to get one?

Can you get access to see what info is being kept on you?

Who has access to this information?

Rumor is at the mo that this is part of an EU wide initiative and all th countries in it will be pushing for ID cards. Presumably that would mean there'd be a central-office in Brussels or somewhere like that that would house all EU members info.

I'm in two minds about this issue.

On the one hand we do live in a post-9/11 world and Britain seems to have more capability than some other countries to absorb anonymous international nutbars who can easily blend into a city like London. I've also personally been appalled by the ease that someone can abuse the NHS or other public services. I used to think it an affront here in Canada that the first thing they ask you for at the doctor's office, or if you're arriving mortally wounded at a hospital is your health card. (I'm sure you'd get treated without one, but you'd still get the bill afterwards). But then I think back to when I lived in Britain and no doctor or health care institution ever asked for any proof that I was living there at all. Similarly, you can't get a job, set up a bank account or even a telephone bill here without a Social Insurance number. Again it feels Orwellian, but as a British friend of mine who tried to live here illegally found out - the system works.

On the other hand, I fear that Britain, especially under Blunkett, is becoming the epitome of the watched nanny state. I'm shocked by the number and scale of CCTV cameras when I visit and the slow erosion of personal liberties and freedoms that would have been unthinkable in Britain just 20 years ago. I just don't trust the intentions of the British government, no matter what they say. Just a gut feeling I guess.

Well put Lee. One way I judge the Nanny State is to think of how Americans would feel if their representatives proposed CCTV etc that are pretty common in the UK. I think they'd balk quite a bit!

[quote="Lee"]Similarly, you can't get a job, set up a bank account or even a telephone bill here without a Social Insurance number. Again it feels Orwellian, but as a British friend of mine who tried to live here illegally found out - the system works.

I got a bank account (Wells Fargo), had a job (and got paid) and had my mortgage approved and got a cell phone, all without a social security number although this was the back end of 2001 and in the US not Canada.

Not sure about the having to pay for it bit, but as I recall this was the same with photocard driving licences except if you changed address and then you got them free (still do I think).

If you are not required to carry them then it is not really a big deal IMO. So many people/organisations have information about you, this may just all be in one place......if you have nothing to hide (and most people won't) it probably won't be as bad as some of the scaremongers are predicting.

I go back to the UK a lot and will be relocating permanently next year and don't have a problem with CCTV cameras....again I have nothing to hide but I can see why some think it is an invasion of their privacy.

Well it's wierd. I admit to a double standard.

What I'm saying is that here in Canada, I guess I very generally trust governments here to use the information on our health cards and social insurance cards, for the purpose it was intended for, to protect Canadians from fraud, illegal immigration etc. The provincial and federal governments here are such dopey, nine-to-five bureaucrats to begin with, I don't credit them with the gumption to do much that is sinister with the information. I don't totally buy into all-Canadians-are-nice stereotypes, but I think there is a fair bit of decent moral fibre here and culturally more of a basic trust that public institutions try to do their best.

I can't explain why I don't trust the British government with the same information. Maybe it's that long history of intelligence, spying and secretive defensive government. There has to be a cultural reason why Britain turns out the best, sinister spy/police/political intrigue/cover-up/conspiracy/forensic series in the world like 'Spooks'.

But I also just get the general cultural feeling in my water that Britain has transformed from a country that had robust individuals from the post-war generation, some of whom admittedly who were barking mad, defending individual freedoms against stupid government, to a country that are a bunch of obedient sheep. And I think this has only been compounded by terrorist threats in recent years.

There is the tired old phrase that Orwell would turn in his grave. Well these days I'm sure he is rotating at high speed.

And with this particular government I've watched David Blunkett slowly browbeat the populace into believing this mandate and I just find it all a bit worrying.

For instance, nobody would be more glad than me to see yob culture in Britain tackled to the ground than me. I can honestly say that it is one of the aspects of British life that has personally made my life a misery there, and makes me most hesitant about moving back. And I believe Tony Blair is reasonably sincere about tackling it (although he's such a priggish middle-class Christian I think he's way out of his depth). But so far the measures that Blunkett has taken seem to have done plenty to reduce peoples' personal freedom and permit the police outrageous petty powers and done virtually nothing to reduce the problem.

I find it an absolute tragedy what is being allowed to happen in front of peoples' noses.

Hate to take the piss, but I don't think he watches them :lol:

Yes I nearly said something like "Under Blunkett's gaze......." lol

Reading this-

"An earlier plan for a combined passport and ID card has been abandoned."

and this-

"The ID card, which will contain biometric data"

Does this mean that the UK have abandoned plans to introduce the biometric passport that the US are pushing for??

If the UK go with a regular passport plus these biometric ID cards will that satisfy the US's requirements??

just wondering........

I still have my identity card from World War 2. I have only had to present it about twice the last time was in 1940 +/- on the double decker Red United Bus Co. bus going from Middlesbrough to Redcar .Soldiers,with rifles, stopped the bus on the Trunk Road and checked our cards~no Nazi spy's that day on that bus.. D